When will this barbarism end?

[fenrir]

Married at 9, slain by parents at 17 | NEWS.com.au

How can any animal justify this horrror?

[Wodin]

Yes sickening.........and your point is?

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by Wodin Yes sickening.........and your point is?

Agree - dreadful, indefensible.

What is the purpose of the post and the comment?

[fenrir]

My point is that I am so tired of seeing such things in the news and realizing it is never going to end, especially because the killing took place in front of the police and a lawmaker of the country in question defends it. The live burial of the other five women mentioned in the article was the kicker. I read this article when my two-year-old daughter was playing with her toys next to me and it depressed the hell out of me. How can people do this to their own children?

[DDT]

Originally Posted by Gypsy Agree - dreadful, indefensible. What is the purpose of the post and the comment?

Lookout! ......The Thought Police have arrived!

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by fenrir My point is that I am so tired of seeing such things in the news and realizing it is never going to end, especially because the killing took place in front of the police and a lawmaker of the country in question defends it. The live burial of the other five women mentioned in the article was the kicker. I read this article when my two-year-old daughter was playing with her toys next to me and it depressed the hell out of me. How can people do this to their own children?

I have no idea-it defeats me entirely.

I guess you have to take comfort from the fact that it is so rare that it gets reported, and right thinking people the world over, including Pakistan, condemn it.

It is also important IMO not to deduce the general from the specific and condemn all Pakistanis for this, or tar them with the same brush. The road the western "civilised" nations took to get to where we are was rocky and uneven, and littered with millions of examples of behaviour like this. Now we believe that these things are wrong - but forexample it was only about 200 years ago that "witches" were being burned alive in the civilised west.

It will take time for some places to catch up, but they will. The fact that the girl in question was taking her life in her hands and had won a court decision is a massive step forward, and is with our struggle in the west it sadly takes people as brave as she, and the sacrifice they make, in order to make progress.

As I have said before on this forum, I believe in the essential goodness of people, there are always villains,there always will be, but ignorance and cruelty are being defeated by knowledge and goodness, and always will be.

Sometimes it just takes time.

[Kvartiraokhotnik]

Originally Posted by Gypsy I have no idea-it defeats me entirely. I guess you have to take comfort from the fact that it is so rare that it gets reported, and right thinking people the world over, including Pakistan, condemn it. It is also important IMO not to deduce the general from the specific and condemn all Pakistanis for this, or tar them with the same brush. The road the western "civilised" nations took to get to where we are was rocky and uneven, and littered with millions of examples of behaviour like this. Now we believe that these things are wrong - but forexample it was only about 200 years ago that "witches" were being burned alive in the civilised west. It will take time for some places to catch up, but they will. The fact that the girl in question was taking her life in her hands and had won a court decision is a massive step forward, and is with our struggle in the west it sadly takes people as brave as she, and the sacrifice they make, in order to make progress. As I have said before on this forum, I believe in the essential goodness of people, there are always villains,there always will be, but ignorance and cruelty are being defeated by knowledge and goodness, and always will be. Sometimes it just takes time.

Witches still get burned in the west! Just look at the expat forum

You really are demonstrating an arrogance without equal.
The ''civilised'' western man as the ideal for all OTHER barbarian cultures to follow. (same as the old Roman empire)

These words are enough to make me violently ill.

In what way is war civilised? Western society has been butchering its population for the last 100 years on an unprecedented scale. No such thing as a civilian anymore. Both soldiers and civilians are targets. Just look at the numbers who died in the major wars. How civilised we were in vietnam, and WWI and II. The Vietnamese must be so happy that we went over and civilised their population. They must be so grateful for our philanthropy.
When the conquistadors got to America they thought the same. They were there to civilise the savages. Same with the British empire. Teach these Africans how to be good people.
We use the same logic against Mugabe today (the savage who attacked the white farmers)

I have utter contempt for this world conquering arrogance.

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by DDT Lookout! ......The Thought Police have arrived!

God - you are pathetic!

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by Kvartiraokhotnik Witches still get burned in the west! Just look at the expat forum You really are demonstrating an arrogance without equal. The ''civilised'' western man as the ideal for all OTHER barbarian cultures to follow. (same as the old Roman empire) These words are enough to make me violently ill. In what way is war civilised? Western society has been butchering its population for the last 100 years on an unprecedented scale. No such thing as a civilian anymore. Both soldiers and civilians are targets. Just look at the numbers who died in the major wars. How civilised we were in vietnam, and WWI and II. The Vietnamese must be so happy that we went over and civilised their population. They must be so grateful for our philanthropy. When the conquistadors got to America they thought the same. They were there to civilise the savages. Same with the British empire. Teach these Africans how to be good people. We use the same logic against Mugabe today (the savage who attacked the white farmers) I have utter contempt for this world conquering arrogance.

Brilliant.

DDT about to work himself up into one of his rants because I represent the left wing,liberal, political correctness he abhors,as a quick look at any of my posts will show you, and you having a go at me for right wing white supremacy arrogance.

Marvellous - I must be doing something right.

Kvarti - go back to the stone you crawled out from under, at least DDT has intelligence and some beliefs and argues fairly consistently on them-you fail to understand very basic english.

But just to humour you one more time: In the context of this discussion the western democracies are civilised.We do not employ child labour,we dorespect the rights of minorities, we try not to discriminate racially, we try and help thosein more need of help than ourselves whether privately, domestically or internationally. we have established intra national bodies to do this. Are we perfect?No - and nowhere in my post willyou find any evidence that I think we are. I believe we should do very much more, both dometically and internationally -putting words in DDT's mouth, I would guess he thinks the opposite, but we argue about degrees.

Yes, we are civilised, we try and hearts are in the right place.

Do we get things wrong and screw up? Of course we do we are human.

But I will repeat - just for you as you have shown it takes at least 6 explanations before you understand simple english - I believe in the essential goodness in people, and Pakistan will catch up, and the attitudes of the father and his supporters are being marginalised and will increasingly be so.

But thank you for the laugh - being attacked for white supremacist opinions atthe same time as leading the PC Thought Police is richly comic.

[Kvartiraokhotnik]

Originally Posted by Gypsy Brilliant. DDT about to work himself up into one of his rants because I represent the left wing,liberal, political correctness he abhors,as a quick look at any of my posts will show you, and you having a go at me for right wing white supremacy arrogance. Marvellous - I must be doing something right. Kvarti - go back to the stone you crawled out from under, at least DDT has intelligence and some beliefs and argues fairly consistently on them-you fail to understand very basic english. But just to humour you one more time: In the context of this discussion the western democracies are civilised.We do not employ child labour,we dorespect the rights of minorities, we try not to discriminate racially, we try and help thosein more need of help than ourselves whether privately, domestically or internationally. we have established intra national bodies to do this. Are we perfect?No - and nowhere in my post willyou find any evidence that I think we are. I believe we should do very much more, both dometically and internationally -putting words in DDT's mouth, I would guess he thinks the opposite, but we argue about degrees. Yes, we are civilised, we try and hearts are in the right place. Do we get things wrong and screw up? Of course we do we are human. But I will repeat - just for you as you have shown it takes at least 6 explanations before you understand simple english - I believe in the essential goodness in people, and Pakistan will catch up, and the attitudes of the father and his supporters are being marginalised and will increasingly be so. But thank you for the laugh - being attacked for white supremacist opinions atthe same time as leading the PC Thought Police is richly comic.

White supremacist...your words. Not mine.

I would say you hold an opinion which is responsible for the deaths of many ''non civilised'' inhabitants, the world over. This arrogance which thinks that the wars the west are involved in are unavoidable, whereas other cultures are just barbarians.

I'll remind you that the incident in Pakistan mentioned above is one horrible event. Do horrible events ever happen in the ''civilised world''??

Dunblane
Harold Shipman
Virginia Tech
Columbine

Yes they do.
Are millions killed in the names of such fine things as freedom and democracy? Yes they are.
These ''other cultures'' may not think of us as ''civilised'' at all. They probably call us the monsters.

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by Kvartiraokhotnik White supremacist...your words. Not mine. I would say you hold an opinion which is responsible for the deaths of many ''non civilised'' inhabitants, the world over. This arrogance which thinks that the wars the west are involved in are unavoidable, whereas other cultures are just barbarians.

Ok. Show me one post out of 2000+ where I have even hinted at this, or have the guts to apologise. This is a despicable libel.

I'll remind you that the incident in Pakistan mentioned above is one horrible event. Do horrible events ever happen in the ''civilised world''??

The answer is in my first post. Again in failing to read and comprehend simple english you make yourself out to be a fool.

Are millions killed in the names of such fine things as freedom and democracy? Yes they are.

A point I have made many times on this forum which is why the likes of DDT refer to me as the Thought Police and decry my liberalism and Political correctness. What it has to do with my post or Fenrir's original post is at best unclear - so no change there then.

These ''other cultures'' may not think of us as ''civilised'' at all. They probably call us the monsters.

No sh*t Sherlock.

I will be waiting for that apology - before you indulge in such defamation do a little research.

[Kvartiraokhotnik]

Originally Posted by Gypsy Ok. Show me one post out of 2000+ where I have even hinted at this, or have the guts to apologise. This is a despicable libel. The answer is in my first post. Again in failing to read and comprehend simple english you make yourself out to be a fool. A point I have made many times on this forum which is why the likes of DDT refer to me as the Thought Police and decry my liberalism and Political correctness. What it has to do with my post or Fenrir's original post is at best unclear - so no change there then. No sh*t Sherlock. I will be waiting for that apology - before you indulge in such defamation do a little research.

Sorry for offending, but this is exactly how you come across.

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by Kvartiraokhotnik Sorry for offending, but this is exactly how you come across.

Not toanyone whohad actually bothered to read what I wrote:

I guess you have to take comfort from the fact that it is so rare that it gets reported, and right thinking people the world over, including Pakistan, condemn it. It is also important IMO not to deduce the general from the specific and condemn all Pakistanis for this, or tar them with the same brush.

Can show me anywhere in these words of my original post,the one you were implying was white supremacist, any western arrogance?

If not then you owe me an apology

I do not believe for a single second that you are sorry -I do not believe you even read my post - you skimmed it,made a judgement about my politics that was 180 degrees out, and attacked that.

[Judge]

Could we please put this white supremacist crap to bed.

Kvartiraokhotnik, from Gypsy's posts on this forum,he's never come across as one .I have never met Gypsy but I have met people who have and they say he's a sound and easy going guy..
So let's cool it.

Thanks.

[kapione]

we look at these cultures thru western eyes, to their eyes and customs this is acceptable and saves family dignity

but what 45 year old man would marry 9 year old, this is to me the disgusting part of the story ...dont gloss over this fact